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Mar 24, 2024 3:41 PM
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Jul 2021
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It's a powerful episode and a good character twist. It's a relief that Maomao's biological father is not just a plotting sociopath.
Mar 24, 2024 4:41 PM
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Jul 2018
562319
Reply to uncleqrow
@Alfredo-Sauce Well, in a way Meimei sacrifices her own happiness for her loyalty towards Fengxian tho.

Meimei is the oldest of the princess, she's already very nearing retirement age (for a courtesan), so she needs to be bought out real soon if she wishes to have a stable future (that's just how the society works at that time). Secondly, Meimei is heavily hinted to has a crush towards Lakan as well. Even Lakan knows that if he wants to buy out a courtesan, it has to be Meimei for her own good.

If I'm not mistaken, Maomao's original plan was for Lakan to buy out Meimei as well. As she said, Fengxian is so sick, she doesn't have long to begin with. There's no point in reuniting the two, so it's much better to let Meimei has a better future instead. But Meimei has a different idea. She reunite Lakan and Fengxian instead, ultimately giving out her chance of being bought out by Lakan. Nevertheless, she was still so happy that Fengxian is finally reunited with Lakan.
@uncleqrow

Meimei aint the oldest...she's the middle
Mar 24, 2024 4:50 PM
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Jul 2017
1035
awful climax to the entire show and the assassination plot is still brushed under the rug
Mar 24, 2024 5:27 PM

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Aug 2022
546
Overall series rating: 9.5/10

Glad that Apothecary Diaries is getting renewed for a new Season next year!

Had the series aired in a less competitive time period, it would have likely been the undisputed "Anime of the Season" winner. Alas, it seemed to have been overshadowed and forced to play second fiddle against shows like Frieren in terms of online hype. It didn't help matters that virtually all the major Anime channels on Youtube gave the series a passing mention at best, instead of giving it the proper attention it deserved.

Now with that out of the way....

If OLM is going to continue with their current scheme of "2 light novel volumes per 24 episodes", it's going to take around 6 more seasons to adapt all of the published books in the series. I sincerely hope the anime can catch up to the books....
Mar 24, 2024 5:36 PM
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Jul 2018
562319
Reply to Unoriginality
I don’t get it, does she hate Lakan or not? When Jinshi mentions Lakan to Maomao for the first time, you can see Maomao face’s full of hatred.

But towards the end of the episode, she suddenly doesn’t hate him. Is it because Maomao realizes that Lakan did finally buy Fengxian? Also did Lakan knows where Fengxian was? Why didn’t he met her? Is it because Verdigris hides her from the public? And why does Verdigris even bothered to do so?

Edit: I figured it out, it was a face of jealousy hatred. She hates him because she is jealous of his naturally gifted talent.
@Unoriginality it's not just that. Anime skipped Lukan scaring moa when she was a child. When granny beat him he tried to reach out to moa while being still a stranger and all bloddy. It traumatized her or something, that's why extreme reaction.

Whatever happened to Fengxian is all on granny. She's Fengxian mother and forced her to be a streetwhore as punishment for getting pregnant (historically, low rank courtesans on streets wouldn't last, majority wouldn't reach 20th birthday due to diseases, failed pregnancies etc) and after everything happened, she blamed Lukan and tried to make moa, her granddaugter into a courtisan.

She's a selfish hyprocrite.

I wish story would acknowledge what a terrible person she is and would get a fitting bad end for herself.
removed-userMar 24, 2024 5:48 PM
Mar 24, 2024 8:50 PM

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May 2019
2957
Reply to uncleqrow
@Alfredo-Sauce Well, in a way Meimei sacrifices her own happiness for her loyalty towards Fengxian tho.

Meimei is the oldest of the princess, she's already very nearing retirement age (for a courtesan), so she needs to be bought out real soon if she wishes to have a stable future (that's just how the society works at that time). Secondly, Meimei is heavily hinted to has a crush towards Lakan as well. Even Lakan knows that if he wants to buy out a courtesan, it has to be Meimei for her own good.

If I'm not mistaken, Maomao's original plan was for Lakan to buy out Meimei as well. As she said, Fengxian is so sick, she doesn't have long to begin with. There's no point in reuniting the two, so it's much better to let Meimei has a better future instead. But Meimei has a different idea. She reunite Lakan and Fengxian instead, ultimately giving out her chance of being bought out by Lakan. Nevertheless, she was still so happy that Fengxian is finally reunited with Lakan.
@uncleqrow
Ok that explains why Maomao said that she thought Meimei would be bought out and also that Fengxian doesn't have long to live. Assuming Lakan takes in Fengxian or pays the madam lady to keep taking care of her then Meimei could be next. Hopefully this is covered in season 2.
Mar 24, 2024 9:39 PM

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Aug 2009
20065
Reply to perseii
@ssjokg Thanks for taking the time to reply.

"Lakan assumed Fengxian was dead": I still don't 100% buy that a military strategist who loves her that much would just give up searching for her. But I can accept that he probably didn't know how he could face her even if he did find her...

"Maomao saw him as a stranger when she was a kid": I now remember that she said something along those lines to Jinshi, thanks. Someone pointed out that Maomao was the brothel's "property" because she was born in the brothel, so there's that, too; Lakan couldn't have simply asked Maomao to come with him.

I now have a better understanding and more sympathy for the characters involved, even if the mistakes and choices everyone made had such horrible consequences that I still feel icky about this. Still, a good story, in the end.
@perseii
I mean, there is much to do.

She got sick by selling herself to the lowest of the low, sick customers and her mind was gone, according to the state of the lettes.They weren't just hiding her from him, they were hiding her from anyone not related to the brothel.


He had no reason to assume granny was lying to him.

Maybe if he didn't have his condition he would have been able to realize based on their reactions in each of his visits.

There is also his self hatred and guilt blocking him from realizing the obvious. He should have figured out what Maomao meant when she made him buy a courtesan or with the blue flower but he even needed Meimei's push and Fengxian's singing voice to figure it out.
Mar 24, 2024 11:43 PM
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Oct 2019
7551
Nahh this is all Madam Granny fault!!
What a terrible person she was.

Lakan finally reunited with Fengxian again 😭
That scene really hit me hard.

Maomao dance sequence was absolutely beautiful.

Really thought we gonna het confession right there but of course Maomao just being Maomao as always.
THAT HEADBUTT THOUGH!! LMAO


9/10
Thank You for OLM for this wonderful adaptation.
Aoi Yuuki GOATED!!

SEASON 2 Confirmed 2025!!
Of course I WILL BE THERE!!
davidyodo24Mar 24, 2024 11:48 PM
Mar 25, 2024 12:13 AM
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May 2020
1
Reply to Mattinator95
They skipped the reason why mao mao kept making that face when larken was mentioned wtf
@Mattinator95
why does she make that face ?
Mar 25, 2024 12:32 AM

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Feb 2011
3696
The character limit prevents me from describing this show in 1 word like it deserves:

PEAK
Mar 25, 2024 4:27 AM

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Jul 2023
2068
There were some emotional moments fitting a finale, Lakan asking her to play go as well as 猫猫 dancing.

But unfortunately (or fortunately), the comedic elements negated any feeling that this is the last episode. Yes, season 2 will come next year.

What this episode does well is to make us crave for more.
patkarununganMar 26, 2024 5:16 PM
Mar 25, 2024 4:56 AM
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Jul 2019
321
Reply to KANLen09
The dried blue rise and the little cut finger, Lakan may still have his regrets, but with Mei Mei having taken him in for recovery, he gets introduced to the Verdigris House's courtesans, and that includes Mei Mei as well. But, she has an offer for him: choose her, or the woman that he has been long awaiting to see for the longest time: his own wife Fengxian, kept in a private and sick room while singing her lullaby, which he instantly recognizes, and buys out immediately for regardless her price. Needless to say, Lakan's salvation is guaranteed.

Maomao with Basen after seeing Loulan and her father, she's fine and all. The same reason why Maomao managed to become part of the Imperial Palace through Lakan as well, it's a guise of observant traits and trickery. Despite the biological linkage between father and daughter, with Lakan able to only distinguish both his daughter and her adopted father Luomen, Maomao's two halves worked to ber benefit. Still though, Lakan as a person, he's not to be underestimated.

Maomao receiving a shawl from Meimei, which was supposed to be used for a courtesan's purchase sendoff, is used for another's instead: Lakan and Fengxian. And now, with her dress, like Concubine Fuyou earlier in the series, she does her dance on the top of the walls, which is an exquisite dance of immaculate animation. But Jinshi appearing straight at her after he'd heard rumours about her climbing up the outer walls, Maomao definitely got a shock, though she doesn't know that her biological parents have reunited after 3 years. But none of that matters now, as with a new fingertip and being an adopted daughter, she is fine, but not without her leg's wound reopening and Jinshi having to escort her like the last when facing Lakan.

Maomao's confession to Jinshi, while it is indicative of love/romance, she's more into poison with the ox bezoar, like a cunning cat lols. Eventually, she still gets the ox bezoar from him, and things within the rear palace are back in order.

After Frieren, Kusuriya is also the matched-unmatched masterpiece.

Season 2 scheduled for 2025, it's not long now.

https://x.com/kusuriya_PR/status/1771573748803543250
@KANLen09
Maoamo knows exactly who Lakan bought out. That's why she was sent the shawl.
Mar 25, 2024 6:13 AM
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Apr 2020
2
As a manga reader I couldn’t give this episode a 5/5 because they cut maomao and lakan meeting for the first time which is one of the greatest moments of this arc and seeing each of their POV’s helps to understand maomao’s dislike of her father, and how truly tragic he is. Also I found Lakan to be too calm when seeing fengxian which I didn’t like, in the manga he seems so much more desperate to be with her, which makes me sob. So it’s a 4/5 from me. A slightly disappointing end to an otherwise perfect adaptation.
Mar 25, 2024 7:16 AM

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Mar 2008
50943
It was sweet how Lakan wanted to be with Fengxian so much still and finally was able to even though it is bittersweet how he was lead to think she is dead and gone.

I can personally confirm your fingertip can grow back especially if you were a baby.

That was a pretty dance and outfit Maomao had and lul did she have to make it seem like she was going to kiss Jinshi? I dont oppose that headbut.
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Mar 25, 2024 7:39 AM

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Jul 2016
8930
Okay, so Xiaomao doesn't "hate" Lakan. Then why the visceral reaction that jump-scared half the viewers some episodes ago?
EDIT: Okay. I read the manga panel someone posted here. Why would you cut that out tho? Just to have Xiaomao dancing for another twenty more seconds?

Anyways, guess I will keep this simple since I'm clearly in the minority here.
Aside from some nice visuals and a very captivating color palette, I found this anime to be extremely average from beginning to end. Easily 95% of the cast was forgettable, mysteries as well as most of the cases were poorly executed and though Xiaomao was the only appealing aspect this adaptation had, seeing her being the perfect MC who solves cases without struggle and is knowledgeable of practically any subject the plot demands her to be wasn't interesting in the slightest. Not to mention her conveniently ignoring the obvious clues related to Jinshi's identity was frustrating beyond belief.
And let's better not talk about how she can withstand a lethal blow to the head from someone thrice her size...

All that said, I'm not sure whether I will give Season 2 a chance or not. I will have to think about it. I also heard one of the following arcs will be about the previous Emperor and his "fascination" for taking little girls as concubines so yeah...

5/10 - Old hag from the brothel can burn in hell, by the way. Truly the only villain in all this.
Mar 25, 2024 10:03 AM

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Jun 2008
1963
This anime is simply perfection. Loved everything about it. 10/10

Laughed out loud when Maomao started talking about Lakan landing that shot :D

And her tricking us at the end but ending up headbutting Jinshi was a great end to the episode. Expected nothing else.
Mar 25, 2024 10:10 AM
Mar 25, 2024 10:32 AM
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Feb 2009
15
The adventures of the crafty cat, Maomao and her solving the mysteries of the imperial court and locale. Fun and tragic characters alike, and another season confirmed. The last arc dragged it down from where it was competing for AOTS/AOTY - certain details missing and also the misdirection heading into it which I was not a fan of.

9/10
Mar 25, 2024 1:55 PM
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Mar 2019
10221
Lakan's tears nearly got to me.
I don't always go with the flow, but i Loved this every week.
Back to catching up with the Manga then, instead of the long wait for more.
10 from me.
Mar 25, 2024 2:13 PM
Level 6 esper

Online
May 2021
1144
Wonderful show, I can understand everyone who will give it a 8 or 9. For me, because the story is not finished yet, I think it was good.
7/10
“Do what feels right in your heart. You will be criticized either way.” (Eleanor Roosevelt)
Mar 25, 2024 3:15 PM
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Jul 2018
562319
Reply to SouthRzVa
Okay, so Xiaomao doesn't "hate" Lakan. Then why the visceral reaction that jump-scared half the viewers some episodes ago?
EDIT: Okay. I read the manga panel someone posted here. Why would you cut that out tho? Just to have Xiaomao dancing for another twenty more seconds?

Anyways, guess I will keep this simple since I'm clearly in the minority here.
Aside from some nice visuals and a very captivating color palette, I found this anime to be extremely average from beginning to end. Easily 95% of the cast was forgettable, mysteries as well as most of the cases were poorly executed and though Xiaomao was the only appealing aspect this adaptation had, seeing her being the perfect MC who solves cases without struggle and is knowledgeable of practically any subject the plot demands her to be wasn't interesting in the slightest. Not to mention her conveniently ignoring the obvious clues related to Jinshi's identity was frustrating beyond belief.
And let's better not talk about how she can withstand a lethal blow to the head from someone thrice her size...

All that said, I'm not sure whether I will give Season 2 a chance or not. I will have to think about it. I also heard one of the following arcs will be about the previous Emperor and his "fascination" for taking little girls as concubines so yeah...

5/10 - Old hag from the brothel can burn in hell, by the way. Truly the only villain in all this.
@SouthRzVa This show's whole appeal is Moamoa. +Theme and visuals.
Mar 25, 2024 4:06 PM
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Dec 2021
1424
hated this, personally.
Mar 25, 2024 4:37 PM
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Oct 2022
275
ssjokg said:
He should have figured out what Maomao meant when she made him buy a courtesan or with the blue flower but he even needed Meimei's push and Fengxian's singing voice to figure it out.


What do you mean ”He should have figured it out"? This is an extremely cryptic message, to put it generously.

JOY_OJ said:
why does she make that face ?


When she was a little kid, the dude deadass walked up to her, totally bloodied, and started cackling, creeping closer and closer. Apparently she didn't even know who he was.

SouthRzVa said:
Then why the visceral reaction that jump-scared half the viewers some episodes ago?


Anime really fucked it up by making her look so absolutely livid, when in the manga, she looks disgusted. That wasn't a "Oh god, no!" face, It was a "I will hoist you by your balls and saw them off with a single strand of hair if you ever bring him up again" face.
Mar 25, 2024 5:07 PM
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Sep 2020
46
Say what you will about Lakan, he's loyal to his woman.
Mar 25, 2024 7:30 PM
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Sep 2018
29
Show had a good start but got weaker and weaker, by just repeating the story of maomao being amazing gigabrain at everything and jinshi just cumming at the mere sight of her, its a real shame that there was literally no progression between anything even remotely related to main cast.
Mar 25, 2024 11:19 PM

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Apr 2019
481
Maomao remembers the deal about the ox bezoar lol, good to see Maomao's biological parents reunite, Lakan finally reunites with the love of his life.
Mar 26, 2024 12:43 AM

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Apr 2023
136
Oh please Maomao! Just STOP! You are beautiful and you were even more beautiful when dancing, but please stop moving and let the wound on your leg heal in peace! I know you are resistant and have an "eccentric" way of treating your body, but I can't deal with that, if I were Jinshi I would lock you in the room and you would only come out fully healed. You messy kitten!😻
I can't wait to see you next season, I'm giving you a 9/10 for this one!
Mar 26, 2024 1:33 AM

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Aug 2009
20065
Reply to HyperlinkBlocked
ssjokg said:
He should have figured out what Maomao meant when she made him buy a courtesan or with the blue flower but he even needed Meimei's push and Fengxian's singing voice to figure it out.


What do you mean ”He should have figured it out"? This is an extremely cryptic message, to put it generously.

JOY_OJ said:
why does she make that face ?


When she was a little kid, the dude deadass walked up to her, totally bloodied, and started cackling, creeping closer and closer. Apparently she didn't even know who he was.

SouthRzVa said:
Then why the visceral reaction that jump-scared half the viewers some episodes ago?


Anime really fucked it up by making her look so absolutely livid, when in the manga, she looks disgusted. That wasn't a "Oh god, no!" face, It was a "I will hoist you by your balls and saw them off with a single strand of hair if you ever bring him up again" face.
@HyperlinkBlocked
Because Lakan IS smart despite fucking it up once or twice with Fengxian.

If his daughter who definitely got her braincells from him(Fengxian is just as smart) can deduce all that shit in the series then he should as well.

Maomao is even jealous of his intellect, which is stopped only by his lack of motivation.
Mar 26, 2024 2:29 AM
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Mar 2024
3
Good. I ENJOYED THIS ANIME
Mar 26, 2024 4:38 AM
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Feb 2021
274
I miss maomao so much.
Mar 26, 2024 5:07 AM

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Feb 2019
2663
A great ending to this awesome anime. I'm glad that Lakan and Fengxian got their happy ending, even if it won't be for long. Still, I'm not sure how I feel about Fengxian basically doing nothing as Maomao's mother except giving birth to her. Her reasons are understandable, but still.

I do hope that one day Maomao and Lakan can somehow get closer. It's not that he didn't want to be there as her father. We saw that he tried to be when Maomao was too little to remember, but maybe for the best Maomao wasn't allowed to, probably by the Old Lady. But in any case, I hope they can become closer one day. But no one can replace Luomen as her primary father.

Great ending there. I can't believe Meimei got bought out and we don't know by who or how. Maomao can't even properly say goodbye to her, can't show her her dance. But that was a great dance from Maomao. If she had not been kidnapped, she might be on her way to become a courtesan by now.

Such a great series. Ranks right up there this year along with Frieren and Oshi no Ko. I'm so glad S2 has been announced! Can't wait to see more of Maomao.
Mar 26, 2024 5:26 AM
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Oct 2022
275
Reply to ssjokg
@HyperlinkBlocked
Because Lakan IS smart despite fucking it up once or twice with Fengxian.

If his daughter who definitely got her braincells from him(Fengxian is just as smart) can deduce all that shit in the series then he should as well.

Maomao is even jealous of his intellect, which is stopped only by his lack of motivation.
@ssjokg This isn't about deduction. She gave him a flower. She didn't "deduce" the message, she made it. I don't think the man even knew the woman was alive at that point, so he literally lacked the information needed to even begin to interpret said message. Never mind the fact that it's extremely cryptic. Fact is, this could only be understood in hindsight.
Mar 26, 2024 6:22 AM

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Jun 2019
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Dukino said:
Honestly I'm not sure what the point has been of the Lakan redemption arc these past few episodes. He's a vile despicable wretch that's only been horrible to those around him, just look at his interactions with Jinshi back when we first saw him. Nothing can erase the pain he's done. I feel like this story is trying to send the message of forgive your parents for the bad things they did to you as a kid. Which is absolutely unacceptable and ridiculous. Lakan made his bed now he needs to lay in it, he's awful and nothing can repair that. I hope that Maomao never talks to him or even mentions his name the entire rest of the story. This show was pretty good until the the last episodes of this first season. I enjoyed seeing Maomao flourish in the inner palace of the emperor as she caught the eye of Jinshi. Bringing her so called dad into the mix just made things insufferable. I hated any scene with him or any storyline trying to explain away his awful actions. This author needs to stick with medicinal espionage instead of inter familial relationships became their sense of the latter is warped beyond repair. Season two next year better not show that crustacean ever again.


Honestly, it's this post which is completely ridiculous, not the story or its writing of this subplot. Other than having a neurological condition of face-blindness, being somewhat eccentric/quirky and awkward around people because of his condition, upbringing, and the way he's lived up to now, what exactly has he done? Fell in love with a woman, impregnated her unbeknownst to him during a time chosen by her and of her planning, and then got unexpectedly sent overseas for years to study and train after being ordered by his family, only to come back and find out his life and the woman he cared for were shattered and in pieces due to unfortunate circumstances and knowledge he wasn't privy to? It's set in a high fantasy alternate world version of medieval/dynastic, like 1400s era China, not modern 2020s Earth where he was conveniently accessible to receive a call or text message and simply turned his new smartphone off for three years.

This kind of lack of understanding, unforgiving ruthless attitude toward someone who hasn't even been shown to do something overtly cruel or malicious themselves, whether to Fengxian, Maomao, or anyone else depicted in the series, is a lot more "vile" and "despicable", in my view, than anything Lakan is either shown or even said to have done.

And I'm not one obsessed with or overly emotionally-invested in these characters to even say this. I enjoyed the show, but it's just a good and solid, 7/10-tier series to me. But for the life of me I cannot understand what would motivate a person to be so extreme and narrow-minded toward a random person (or even fictional character's!) slightest flaws or mistakes. Perhaps that's a lack of imagination and failing on my part, but it just seems completely bizarre and unwarranted, like "The punishment not fitting the crime" times a million. In this case the "crime" wasn't even a crime. It was a simple misunderstanding and human miscommunication error that could literally happen to anyone on any aspect of life anytime for any reason.
Mar 26, 2024 8:05 AM
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it was a great experience :)
Mar 26, 2024 11:15 AM
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Reply to WatchTillTandava
Dukino said:
Honestly I'm not sure what the point has been of the Lakan redemption arc these past few episodes. He's a vile despicable wretch that's only been horrible to those around him, just look at his interactions with Jinshi back when we first saw him. Nothing can erase the pain he's done. I feel like this story is trying to send the message of forgive your parents for the bad things they did to you as a kid. Which is absolutely unacceptable and ridiculous. Lakan made his bed now he needs to lay in it, he's awful and nothing can repair that. I hope that Maomao never talks to him or even mentions his name the entire rest of the story. This show was pretty good until the the last episodes of this first season. I enjoyed seeing Maomao flourish in the inner palace of the emperor as she caught the eye of Jinshi. Bringing her so called dad into the mix just made things insufferable. I hated any scene with him or any storyline trying to explain away his awful actions. This author needs to stick with medicinal espionage instead of inter familial relationships became their sense of the latter is warped beyond repair. Season two next year better not show that crustacean ever again.


Honestly, it's this post which is completely ridiculous, not the story or its writing of this subplot. Other than having a neurological condition of face-blindness, being somewhat eccentric/quirky and awkward around people because of his condition, upbringing, and the way he's lived up to now, what exactly has he done? Fell in love with a woman, impregnated her unbeknownst to him during a time chosen by her and of her planning, and then got unexpectedly sent overseas for years to study and train after being ordered by his family, only to come back and find out his life and the woman he cared for were shattered and in pieces due to unfortunate circumstances and knowledge he wasn't privy to? It's set in a high fantasy alternate world version of medieval/dynastic, like 1400s era China, not modern 2020s Earth where he was conveniently accessible to receive a call or text message and simply turned his new smartphone off for three years.

This kind of lack of understanding, unforgiving ruthless attitude toward someone who hasn't even been shown to do something overtly cruel or malicious themselves, whether to Fengxian, Maomao, or anyone else depicted in the series, is a lot more "vile" and "despicable", in my view, than anything Lakan is either shown or even said to have done.

And I'm not one obsessed with or overly emotionally-invested in these characters to even say this. I enjoyed the show, but it's just a good and solid, 7/10-tier series to me. But for the life of me I cannot understand what would motivate a person to be so extreme and narrow-minded toward a random person (or even fictional character's!) slightest flaws or mistakes. Perhaps that's a lack of imagination and failing on my part, but it just seems completely bizarre and unwarranted, like "The punishment not fitting the crime" times a million. In this case the "crime" wasn't even a crime. It was a simple misunderstanding and human miscommunication error that could literally happen to anyone on any aspect of life anytime for any reason.
@WatchTillTandava I think his issue is the clash between how the show painted Lakan up until that point, and how it paints him after we start exploring the situation. Remember: He sat around like some schemer, pulling string after string, and talking to Jinshi about his life like he's the greatest evil genius to ever live. For example: Remember the bit about reducing a courtesan's value? He wasn't talking about it like it's a little bit of trivia he learned throughout life, he was talking about how he pulled said trick, IIRC. Not to mention the anime over-doing Maomao's reaction to him, switching from disgust to absolute hatred.

It painted him as the bad guy far too well, so turning around and telling us he's actually some victim in all of this is jarring.
Mar 26, 2024 11:17 AM

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Reply to HyperlinkBlocked
@ssjokg This isn't about deduction. She gave him a flower. She didn't "deduce" the message, she made it. I don't think the man even knew the woman was alive at that point, so he literally lacked the information needed to even begin to interpret said message. Never mind the fact that it's extremely cryptic. Fact is, this could only be understood in hindsight.
@HyperlinkBlocked I didnt say that giving him a flower was a deduction. I said that things she has done so far in all cases were deductions with random pieces of evidence, less than circumstantial evidence most of the time.

Mar 26, 2024 12:12 PM

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HyperlinkBlocked said:
I think his issue is the clash between how the show painted Lakan up until that point, and how it paints him after we start exploring the situation. Remember: He sat around like some schemer, pulling string after string, and talking to Jinshi about his life like he's the greatest evil genius to ever live. For example: Remember the bit about reducing a courtesan's value? He wasn't talking about it like it's a little bit of trivia he learned throughout life, he was talking about how he pulled said trick, IIRC. Not to mention the anime over-doing Maomao's reaction to him, switching from disgust to absolute hatred.

It painted him as the bad guy far too well, so turning around and telling us he's actually some victim in all of this is jarring.


Yes, but it became clear to me in retrospect upon watching the last few episodes and finishing the series that that was just an example of clearly intentional misdirect. The writing and direction took, what now seems to me to be obvious creative and artistic license, to frame things in a certain manner so that a new and different perspective could be gained on the character who was hitherto presented as all one way and in the opposite light (as devious and villainous, not tragic, sympathetic, and himself a victim of circumstances), so as to make for something of a surprise and even greater emotional catharsis later on. At least from a certain segment of the audience. To those for whom it was not successful, obviously all that can really be said is that it's naturally completely subjective. But anime and good television and film in general does this all the time as it lends a sense of depth and certain mystery and richness/complexity to the world where any individual person, place, event, or other thing can be perceived multiple different ways based on the inherent bias or prejudice of the individual characters perceiving and reacting to them, those of the audience, unreliable narrators, etc.

A character can be presented a certain way just because that is the way the other characters onscreen at the time are perceiving them, or because they are written with a certain tone, flair, and exaggeration to underscore certain aspects of their personality, but when you look just at what they literally said and did throughout the length of the series and their appearances, line for line, scene by scene, dramatization and emotionally-reflexive reaction to it removed, you find that it all can easily be explained or seen another way.
WatchTillTandavaMar 26, 2024 12:17 PM
Mar 26, 2024 12:12 PM
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Reply to ssjokg
@HyperlinkBlocked I didnt say that giving him a flower was a deduction. I said that things she has done so far in all cases were deductions with random pieces of evidence, less than circumstantial evidence most of the time.

@ssjokg There's a big difference between piecing together events from evidence, and reading someone's mind through wilted flower divination. They're two different skillsets, the same way you can profile people down to a T, but never actually know what they want. By your logic, Autistic Savants should actually the best in social situations. Again: Adding to that, the fact that the man probably still didn't know the woman was even alive, and there was no way he could even begin to process the message, much less reach the right conclusion.

Now unless I'm forgetting some other incident in the show where someone sent Maomao a coded message with chicken gizzard and nail clippings, I'd wager we haven't actually seen her excel at the task either.
Mar 26, 2024 12:21 PM

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@ssjokg There's a big difference between piecing together events from evidence, and reading someone's mind through wilted flower divination. They're two different skillsets, the same way you can profile people down to a T, but never actually know what they want. By your logic, Autistic Savants should actually the best in social situations. Again: Adding to that, the fact that the man probably still didn't know the woman was even alive, and there was no way he could even begin to process the message, much less reach the right conclusion.

Now unless I'm forgetting some other incident in the show where someone sent Maomao a coded message with chicken gizzard and nail clippings, I'd wager we haven't actually seen her excel at the task either.
@HyperlinkBlocked Maomao again and again has to remind herself to not make conclusions, that end up being right anyway, without evidence, something Luomen taught her.

Maomao has also established that Lakan does the opposite. Goes with gut feeling instead of hard evidence. She also establishes that he doesnt even try, even tho he is more intelligent than she is, which is where her jealousy for him comes from.

I am not saying that he SHOULD HAVE figured it out and I dont fault him for not doing it. But it could be possible.
Mar 26, 2024 1:04 PM
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Between Kusuriya and Frieren, this season has peaked so high. The edutainment from the medical trivia and the mistery is one of the many things that make this series so unique. Not to mention the social subtext often hinting at the women conditions at those times, such an original theme, as the way it's presented. Maomao is one of the most faceted female characters you can see around, the way she is written is praiseworthy. My only complaint is about waiting an entire year for the season 2.
Mar 26, 2024 1:05 PM
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Reply to WatchTillTandava
HyperlinkBlocked said:
I think his issue is the clash between how the show painted Lakan up until that point, and how it paints him after we start exploring the situation. Remember: He sat around like some schemer, pulling string after string, and talking to Jinshi about his life like he's the greatest evil genius to ever live. For example: Remember the bit about reducing a courtesan's value? He wasn't talking about it like it's a little bit of trivia he learned throughout life, he was talking about how he pulled said trick, IIRC. Not to mention the anime over-doing Maomao's reaction to him, switching from disgust to absolute hatred.

It painted him as the bad guy far too well, so turning around and telling us he's actually some victim in all of this is jarring.


Yes, but it became clear to me in retrospect upon watching the last few episodes and finishing the series that that was just an example of clearly intentional misdirect. The writing and direction took, what now seems to me to be obvious creative and artistic license, to frame things in a certain manner so that a new and different perspective could be gained on the character who was hitherto presented as all one way and in the opposite light (as devious and villainous, not tragic, sympathetic, and himself a victim of circumstances), so as to make for something of a surprise and even greater emotional catharsis later on. At least from a certain segment of the audience. To those for whom it was not successful, obviously all that can really be said is that it's naturally completely subjective. But anime and good television and film in general does this all the time as it lends a sense of depth and certain mystery and richness/complexity to the world where any individual person, place, event, or other thing can be perceived multiple different ways based on the inherent bias or prejudice of the individual characters perceiving and reacting to them, those of the audience, unreliable narrators, etc.

A character can be presented a certain way just because that is the way the other characters onscreen at the time are perceiving them, or because they are written with a certain tone, flair, and exaggeration to underscore certain aspects of their personality, but when you look just at what they literally said and did throughout the length of the series and their appearances, line for line, scene by scene, dramatization and emotionally-reflexive reaction to it removed, you find that it all can easily be explained or seen another way.
@WatchTillTandava Well yeah, no shit. But the point is that the manga didn't overshoot the mark. In the manga, she's clearly put off by him. In the anime, she clearly hates his guts. I don't know if he did it in the manga, but in the anime, he personally took credit for the whole "Reducing the value of a courtesan" thing. To find out that not only does she not hate him, but also, he was an unwitting victim, at best, in the whole courtesan thing is too big of a change. There's misdirection, then there's gaslighting the audience. They committed so hard to making him out as the bad guy, they had him actually admit to doing bad things explicitly.

The only way to wiggle out of the "trick" issue is that he feels personally responsible for the events of that night. But then it doesn't make sense that he's talking about it in those terms.
Mar 26, 2024 1:36 PM

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HyperlinkBlocked said:
Well yeah, no shit. But the point is that the manga didn't overshoot the mark. In the manga, she's clearly put off by him. In the anime, she clearly hates his guts. I don't know if he did it in the manga, but in the anime, he personally took credit for the whole "Reducing the value of a courtesan" thing. To find out that not only does she not hate him, but also, he was an unwitting victim, at best, in the whole courtesan thing is too big of a change. There's misdirection, then there's gaslighting the audience. They committed so hard to making him out as the bad guy, they had him actually admit to doing bad things explicitly.

The only way to wiggle out of the "trick" issue is that he feels personally responsible for the events of that night. But then it doesn't make sense that he's talking about it in those terms.


I mean, while watching the earlier episodes I always retained an open mind and open heart toward this character and the willingness to see that there could be more to them than initially meets the eye, the same way I do/did for virtually every other character in the series and in everything else I have ever watched.

So while yes, as acknowledged it's an intentional misdirect, it didn't come off that way to me at all that they tonally overshot or oversold it, because I've definitely seen this done with characters before and no episode or individual scene featuring Lakan in it earlier in the series ever made me just close my mind to or write off him and any potential for growth, backstory, or greater depth still unseen as a character. So I think that's just a matter of how every series will be received differently based on everything else people have watched, values and worldview, life experience, etc., because it resonated completely differently with me and I found the use of their technique for earlier portrayal of his character well-executed enough. They never lied and made up anything.

Sometimes a character can be seen doing something which seems unrealistic or out of character, but then it will later be revealed to be a hallucination or a dream sequence. Some folks consider that a cheap writing trick depending on how it's employed. Yet here there wasn't even that. There was just framing, and those who didn't take a hardline stance on the character based on that, like myself, probably had a very different reaction to later developments.

So I can't agree with your or the other user's subjective view on it, although I can acknowledge that it's obviously bound to be divisive for audiences.
Mar 26, 2024 2:18 PM
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even though she didn't love her parents (at least not Lakan) she inadvertently brought them together and gave them a chance at happiness. Mewmew just keeps giving straight Ws
Mar 26, 2024 2:40 PM
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@Unoriginality it's not just that. Anime skipped Lukan scaring moa when she was a child. When granny beat him he tried to reach out to moa while being still a stranger and all bloddy. It traumatized her or something, that's why extreme reaction.

Whatever happened to Fengxian is all on granny. She's Fengxian mother and forced her to be a streetwhore as punishment for getting pregnant (historically, low rank courtesans on streets wouldn't last, majority wouldn't reach 20th birthday due to diseases, failed pregnancies etc) and after everything happened, she blamed Lukan and tried to make moa, her granddaugter into a courtisan.

She's a selfish hyprocrite.

I wish story would acknowledge what a terrible person she is and would get a fitting bad end for herself.
@Pimpi05 Damn, that’s an important detail to skip. Didn’t know that hag is that much of a teribble person she is. I wonder why they decided to skipped that part because some people will be left confused about what and why about certain parts. Hell it probably only took a minute just to make that simple cutscene.
Mar 26, 2024 3:32 PM
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WTFFF WHY THEY CHANGED THE LAKAN SCENE INTO A NIGHT SCENE and also made it as meimei opening a set of doors instead of a window.. in the manga it was that she opened a window that was right there next to her (and she didnt say much except her "pride line" and it was a direct line to the other courtsan room, and it was day time outside and her window was open as well , than he saw her and heard her song and ran from the doors.... making meimei opening the doors and making it a night scene instead of day scene, BASICLY HALVED THE MEANING OF THE PLOT THERE, IT WAS LESS IMPACTFUL in the anime (just like they changed the scene of maomao and made it a jump scare instead, when they could have just copy pasta the scene from the manga lol

ALSO WHY THE HECK THEY CHANGED MAOMAO'S MOTHER BACKSTORY!>!>!>!!!?!?!? SHE DIDNT BECAME SICK BECUZ OF THE MEN SHE SLEPT WITH, SHE BECAME SICK AFTER GIVING BIRTH TO MAOMAO SINCE SHE WAS THROWN AWAY TO THE SLUMPS AND CAUGHT SIPHYLIS THERE... IF SHE GOT SICK BEFORE HAVING MAOMAO, THAN MAOMAO WOULD HAVE HAD IT HEREDETERY (BUT SHE DOESNT: HER HAND PATCHES ARE FROM HER EXPIREMNETS)
Mar 26, 2024 3:45 PM
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this is the best anime i have ever watch
Mar 26, 2024 4:04 PM
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SO HAPPY SEASON 2 GOT CONFIRMED BY THE END OF THE EPISODE!!! OMG THEY BETTER GOT 1:1 TO THE MANGA BECUZ THE NEXT FEW STORIES GONNA BE *CHEF'S KISS* AND THEY BETTER NOT RUIN IT LIKE THEY DID THIS SEASON where they ruined 2 important scenes (maomao face reaction to lakan and lakan meeting maomao's mother & her back story)
Mar 26, 2024 4:25 PM
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Reply to narutosister
WTFFF WHY THEY CHANGED THE LAKAN SCENE INTO A NIGHT SCENE and also made it as meimei opening a set of doors instead of a window.. in the manga it was that she opened a window that was right there next to her (and she didnt say much except her "pride line" and it was a direct line to the other courtsan room, and it was day time outside and her window was open as well , than he saw her and heard her song and ran from the doors.... making meimei opening the doors and making it a night scene instead of day scene, BASICLY HALVED THE MEANING OF THE PLOT THERE, IT WAS LESS IMPACTFUL in the anime (just like they changed the scene of maomao and made it a jump scare instead, when they could have just copy pasta the scene from the manga lol

ALSO WHY THE HECK THEY CHANGED MAOMAO'S MOTHER BACKSTORY!>!>!>!!!?!?!? SHE DIDNT BECAME SICK BECUZ OF THE MEN SHE SLEPT WITH, SHE BECAME SICK AFTER GIVING BIRTH TO MAOMAO SINCE SHE WAS THROWN AWAY TO THE SLUMPS AND CAUGHT SIPHYLIS THERE... IF SHE GOT SICK BEFORE HAVING MAOMAO, THAN MAOMAO WOULD HAVE HAD IT HEREDETERY (BUT SHE DOESNT: HER HAND PATCHES ARE FROM HER EXPIREMNETS)
@narutosister
narutosister said:
TFFF WHY THEY CHANGED THE LAKAN SCENE INTO A NIGHT SCENE and also made it as meimei opening a set of doors instead of a window.. in the manga it was that she opened a window that was right there next to her (and she didnt say much except her "pride line" and it was a direct line to the other courtsan room, and it was day time outside and her window was open as well , than he saw her and heard her song and ran from the doors.... making meimei opening the doors and making it a night scene instead of day scene, BASICLY HALVED THE MEANING OF THE PLOT THERE, IT WAS LESS IMPACTFUL


I don't see how that was less impactful. Also, why did he run away from the doors?

narutosister said:
ALSO WHY THE HECK THEY CHANGED MAOMAO'S MOTHER BACKSTORY!>!>!>!!!?!?!? SHE DIDNT BECAME SICK BECUZ OF THE MEN SHE SLEPT WITH, SHE BECAME SICK AFTER GIVING BIRTH TO MAOMAO SINCE SHE WAS THROWN AWAY TO THE SLUMPS AND CAUGHT SIPHYLIS THERE... IF SHE GOT SICK BEFORE HAVING MAOMAO, THAN MAOMAO WOULD HAVE HAD IT HEREDETERY (BUT SHE DOESNT: HER HAND PATCHES ARE FROM HER EXPIREMNETS)


It's not like they said exactly when she caught syphilis. You just naturally assume it was after Maomao was born.
Mar 26, 2024 5:18 PM
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One of the best animes we had in the last years. The drama, context and how the main characters goind eveolving theirselves in the story is very interesting and intrigating, also it always have some fun together.
Mar 27, 2024 12:10 AM
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i cried like full on cried I haven't done that in years
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